Death Wobble Poll

[ShereKahn]

In the last month or I’ve experienced the death wobble a few times. In every case I was in a slow bend at speed and I hit a bump that went across the entire lane. One was where the road crew tore up the road to replace a drainage pipe and did a shitty job patching the road. The other was on a bridge in the city in a bend and I hit an expansion joint that was tougher than usual. I had to slow to almost a stop to get the steering wheel to stop violently shaking. Lucky for me, I’d experienced it previously. I also noticed increase looseness or a slight wobble with each bump in the road.

I got the recall notice for the dampner and I hoped that would fix it.

2019 Rubicon 2-door with stock suspension/wheels. I have had it off road on some decent trails including some out at MOAB.

After the recall repair was done they told me they did a bunch of other stuff including tightening up the steering and something else my wife didn’t catch.

No more slight jiggle in the wheel, it’s tight and I deliberately went out and hit hard that road repair that consistently created a death wobble.

For me the recall fixed it all

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[AnnDee4444]

Interesting. Of all forum users who responded to the survey, it appears (at least via the eye test) that Sports seem to have the highest instance of Death Wobble. I wonder if there is some design factor common among those models that would cause this, or if it is just the sample size of the data?

I've noticed this too, but have no solid indication as to what it could be. I have a few theories though:

1. The Sport tires are an oscillating uncontrollable mass. My initial theory of death wobble starting with the tires would be partially correct.
2. Shocks are different (I haven't actually verified this), or are less effective due to the ride-height.
3. The increased caster is more death-wobble prone. I highly doubt this is the case, but feel it is worth mentioning since it is technically a difference.
4. Sport buyers drive don't modify their Jeeps as quickly. The factory parts are getting worn out, where as other models would have replaced the death-wobble causing parts already. I'm not trying to stereotype anyone here, just understand the poll results.
5. This is actually an issue with slop in the steering box, and a 2-door will have more slop than a 4-door due to the steering ratio change. Of course this would also mean that there are proportionately more Sport 2-doors.
6. Sport drivers drive faster/more aggressive. Again not trying to stereotype, just looking at all the options.
7. The poll results are not an accurate representation of all Wranglers.

 

[RubiSc0tt]

I've noticed this too, but have no solid indication as to what it could be. I have a few theories though:

1. The Sport tires are an oscillating uncontrollable mass. My initial theory of death wobble starting with the tires would be partially correct.
2. Shocks are different (I haven't actually verified this), or are less effective due to the ride-height.
3. The increased caster is more death-wobble prone. I highly doubt this is the case, but feel it is worth mentioning since it is technically a difference.
4. Sport buyers drive don't modify their Jeeps as quickly. The factory parts are getting worn out, where as other models would have replaced the death-wobble causing parts already. I'm not trying to stereotype anyone here, just understand the poll results.
5. This is actually an issue with slop in the steering box, and a 2-door will have more slop than a 4-door due to the steering ratio change. Of course this would also mean that there are proportionately more Sport 2-doors.
6. Sport drivers drive faster/more aggressive. Again not trying to stereotype, just looking at all the options.
7. The poll results are not an accurate representation of all Wranglers.

I was thinking some of the same things, but again, no real way to verify the results. I was also curious if the weight between hard/soft tops and adding or subtracting a few other options, or differences in spring rate for the coils would affect ride height enough to trigger death wobble between one and the other. it's too bad this turned into a bit of a PR fiasco for Jeep, because the stat and analytics nerd part of my brain would love to see the results from a wider spread of data- namely, more Wranglers affected by the recall.

 

[AnnDee4444]

I was also curious if the weight between hard/soft tops and adding or subtracting a few other options, or differences in spring rate for the coils would affect ride height enough to trigger death wobble between one and the other.

Excellent point about the weight differences. I am familiar with a motorcycle that gets it's version of death-wobble when the weight balance is shifted too far to the rear, I could see the same thing happening here. Come to think of it, my 2.0 JLR did have a very minor death-wobble like shimmy once when it was fairly new (65-70 mph, hit a bump, slight shimmy stopped after 3-4 oscillations). It hasn't happened since, but I did add a winch and the front end is now about 1"-1.5" lower from the weight.

Also a lighter wheel/tire package on the Sport would also mean the un-sprung weight is less, and would be more likely to react to bumps in the road, especially if the spring weight is lighter.

 

[RubiSc0tt]

Excellent point about the weight differences. I am familiar with a motorcycle that gets it's version of death-wobble when the weight balance is shifted too far to the rear, I could see the same thing happening here. Come to think of it, my 2.0 JLR did have a very minor death-wobble like shimmy once when it was fairly new (65-70 mph, hit a bump, slight shimmy stopped after 3-4 oscillations). It hasn't happened since, but I did add a winch and the front end is now about 1"-1.5" lower from the weight.

Also a lighter wheel/tire package on the Sport would also mean the un-sprung weight is less, and would be more likely to react to bumps in the road, especially if the spring weight is lighter.

You actually bring up another good point of differences in drivetrain weight (engine/ Trans options)- differences in 3.6/ 2.0 and the possibility of the manual trans on the 3.6 vs. the Auto on the other two.

If that's even possible, It's kind of surprising the margins for the suspension geometry are that razor thin on the JL, whereas the right conditions/ options can cause it to death wobble.

This is all just guess work based on a very small data sample so it is by no means comprehensive or means anything, course.
Translation: Maybe, But hey- what do I know?
/shrug
</GoodFellasAccent>

 

[cosine]

@AnnDee4444

i had a death wobble today while getting on the parkway. its was a long on ramp that let you keep a decent speed 40-45 mph to enter the parkway. no sharp turn, relatively straight. but was a bit uneven / mix road where the asphalt and concrete meets. when i hit that spot (pretty much straight) my sport started to shake pretty rough. i let off the gas and coasted a bit for the shake to stop and carried on, up to speed at 55-60.

i had one little one on a local road (i think) about a year and a half ago. if i recall it was a rough road on a turn. again let off the gas and the shake stopped.

i have a 2019 base model sport with the hard top. still running stock setup and tires. 3.6 / auto with 12500 miles.

 

[Kluk Ztopolovky]

I just called the dealer for an appointment after I had a bad wobble experience this morning when driving at speed of about 50 miles /h . I must have hit what I think was a minor pothole on the highway . It wasn't the first death wobble I experienced with my [10 K JL ] but it was a violent one . The Jeep was shaking like a toy car and it went on and on for a long time untill I slowed down to about 30 m/h . I haven't done any modifications to my JL at all . I was glad my wife wasn't sitting next to me at that moment because it was really scary.

 

[Whoisalejo]

I picked up a CPO Sport S a few weeks ago (7,900 mi on the odo) (mid December) and not 2 weeks after had death wobble. I put less than 300 miles on the thing and I had death wobble. This is/was really alarming to me. How can a vehicle that the mfg certified get a problem like this.

I took it into the dealership and they said they're going to check for engine misfires, since the suspension components are to the torque spec. I told the guy he must be nuts, no way could this be an engine misfire and it's a CPO, so If the engine was acting up they'd have seen an obd code.

Well they're putting a "flight recorder" on it and are going to put 80-100 miles driving my jeep around to try and recreate it (am i nuts for not being the biggest fan of this?). Any tips or bulletins I can point them to? I get the feeling some mechanics miss these things or are very unaware of rev-2 of certain parts.

 

[SoccerTwinzJL]

I just experienced Death wobble. I was on the highway doing 70mph. I went over a bridge and next thing I know all hell broke loose. 5 weeks ago I went to the dealership for loss of power steering they fixed that by doing a software reset. When I was there they told me that there is a recall on the dampers so they are ordering the dampers for me and will call when it comes in. Well after the wobble I experienced I decided to call the dealership to see if the part was in. they gave me 800 customer service number. So I called them and was told that its on back order and it will be months before I can get it. They also state that its not a safety recall.

 

[Kluk Ztopolovky]

I just experienced Death wobble. I was on the highway doing 70mph. I went over a bridge and next thing I know all hell broke loose. 5 weeks ago I went to the dealership for loss of power steering they fixed that by doing a software reset. When I was there they told me that there is a recall on the dampers so they are ordering the dampers for me and will call when it comes in. Well after the wobble I experienced I decided to call the dealership to see if the part was in. they gave me 800 customer service number. So I called them and was told that its on back order and it will be months before I can get it. They also state that its not a safety recall.

I pretty much have the same experience with my local Toronto dealer. This morning they inspected the Jeep and new steering damper is being ordered. How long the waiting period will be nobody knows. I don't have to do much hwy driving and so I should survive the unspecified waiting period .

I wonder if this new damper is in any way different from the factory one installed in 2019 .

 

[JeepCares]

@AnnDee4444

i had a death wobble today while getting on the parkway. its was a long on ramp that let you keep a decent speed 40-45 mph to enter the parkway. no sharp turn, relatively straight. but was a bit uneven / mix road where the asphalt and concrete meets. when i hit that spot (pretty much straight) my sport started to shake pretty rough. i let off the gas and coasted a bit for the shake to stop and carried on, up to speed at 55-60.

i had one little one on a local road (i think) about a year and a half ago. if i recall it was a rough road on a turn. again let off the gas and the shake stopped.

i have a 2019 base model sport with the hard top. still running stock setup and tires. 3.6 / auto with 12500 miles.

I picked up a CPO Sport S a few weeks ago (7,900 mi on the odo) (mid December) and not 2 weeks after had death wobble. I put less than 300 miles on the thing and I had death wobble. This is/was really alarming to me. How can a vehicle that the mfg certified get a problem like this.

I took it into the dealership and they said they're going to check for engine misfires, since the suspension components are to the torque spec. I told the guy he must be nuts, no way could this be an engine misfire and it's a CPO, so If the engine was acting up they'd have seen an obd code.

Well they're putting a "flight recorder" on it and are going to put 80-100 miles driving my jeep around to try and recreate it (am i nuts for not being the biggest fan of this?). Any tips or bulletins I can point them to? I get the feeling some mechanics miss these things or are very unaware of rev-2 of certain parts.

I just experienced Death wobble. I was on the highway doing 70mph. I went over a bridge and next thing I know all hell broke loose. 5 weeks ago I went to the dealership for loss of power steering they fixed that by doing a software reset. When I was there they told me that there is a recall on the dampers so they are ordering the dampers for me and will call when it comes in. Well after the wobble I experienced I decided to call the dealership to see if the part was in. they gave me 800 customer service number. So I called them and was told that its on back order and it will be months before I can get it. They also state that its not a safety recall.

We are sorry to learn about the experiences that you've had with your steering. Please send our team a private message so that we can have this documented on your behalf and provide additional support while in service.

I just called the dealer for an appointment after I had a bad wobble experience this morning when driving at speed of about 50 miles /h . I must have hit what I think was a minor pothole on the highway . It wasn't the first death wobble I experienced with my [10 K JL ] but it was a violent one . The Jeep was shaking like a toy car and it went on and on for a long time untill I slowed down to about 30 m/h . I haven't done any modifications to my JL at all . I was glad my wife wasn't sitting next to me at that moment because it was really scary.

Unfortunately, we are unable to assist customers outside of the United States. They are in the best position to assist with next steps. Please reach out to the Customer Care in your region at 800-465-2001.

Darlene
Jeep Cares

 

[peet]

For me the recall fixed it all

Hi Brad, just curious, has your jeep experienced DW since the recall damper was applied?

Thanks.
Pete

 

[Tab]

I had experienced DW a few times at 65-75 mph, after searching for info I found that tire pressure can create it, interestingly I did run lower tire pressures, 28-29 to get a even foot hold on the road, I increased my pressures to recommended 36psi and it stopped. BUT I have several times had it do the wiggle right before DW would start, once you have had DW you are so prepared for it to happen that you never really get over the fear of it happening. Since changing the tire pressure to 36 I decided if that made it better that heavier steering parts may improve it even more, not so sure I believe that now, I changed to the synergy tie rod, drag link, trackbar and a trackbar steering sector brace, have not had DW since all these changes but again multiple times I thought it was going to happen. Mine is a Sport S 21, I swapped out the shocks for take off rubicon shocks, running the stock stabilizer, have winch on front adding weight for those interested. Oh and by the way my first windshield at 8 months. ;/

 

[Tab]

Let me bounce this off you guys. Do you think that steering pressure could be the culprit? I mean like the steering is so light that if it had more drag on it maybe it couldn't oscillate back and forth so easily. We tow ours behind our motorhome and I often wonder if it has ever death wobbled while towing. You know the wheel is so hard to turn when even in gravel with the engine not running and so easy when it is.

 

[qnet]

Interesting thread. I didn't realize DW was on unmodified Jeeps with so few miles. I bought my 2 door Sport about a year ago. It had 7300 miles when I bought it. It wasn't CPO but the Carvana guy who delivered it said it may have been a dealer demo, because they had no records of anyone owning it.

I only drove it for a couple of weeks before I had new wheels and 33" tires on it. I added Rubicon takes off springs and teraflex shocks, and this is when I experienced slight DW, not enough to scare me. Added a Steersmarts HD trackbar and teraflex 9500 steering stabilizer and the DW was gone.

Fast forward some months into summer, added a Dynatrack 2" lift and 35" tires. In between times I had my steering box upgraded, as well as intstalling Teraflex front LCA's for a 1.5 - 3.5" lift.

Hit the same bump near my neighborhood that caused the DW to test, and got a very violent
DW that did scare me. It felt like my Jeep was going to shake apart. It was so bad, that the car behind me slowed down to give me some space. I have since avoided that spot.

Other bumps in the road don't bother it, some seemingly worse than that one. It wasn't until going back to my hometown in Missouri, were the roads are worse; that I noticed more DW. I got nervous with every disturbance in the road, because it did it on some, but not others.

I have since replaced my ballsjoints with Dynatrak and tierod with Steersmarts and will go over everything else, checking the torques. Fingers crossed that this solves it. I also hope this info helps others.

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