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Jeep Wrangler 4xe will be name of PHEV Hybrid Electric model. Coming late 2020

56nomad56

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Just got a used Volt for my wife's commute. Couple of features it has that might port well to a PHEV Wrangler:

1) You do not need to brake to activate the battery regen. It has a normal drive mode (coast when you let off the accelerator), and an "L" mode that kicks in the regen immediately and slows the car significantly w/o using the brake pedal. Our first trip was from south OC to Paso Robles, CA. On the way back on a long downhill the battery completely recharged due to the regen, and added 53 miles to our range!

2) It has a paddle behind the steering wheel that will increase the regen even more, to the point the only time I ever use the brakes is coming to a final stop. This greatly reduces wear on the brake components while increasing your range.

3) It has a hold feature, with which you can store the battery charge for later use. Since EVs are more efficient in city driving due to the regen, you can switch to ICE for the highway drive and back to EV. This would theoretically on a Wrangler allow you to use the EV and ICE once you reached a trail for optimal torque and "engine braking" on downhill slopes.

4) I've driven several Model S. The handling is uncanny considering its weight mainly due to the majority of the weight being located in the "skateboard" battery pack. The COG is really low relative to other midsized luxury sedans. I could see an EV Wrangler benefiting from this increased stability.

I for one welcome our new battery-powered overlords. I can't wait to test drive a Rivian R1T or R1S. Wonder if they would let me try the "tank turn" in the parking lot? LOL

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ThirtyOne

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Is nobody going to talk about water and all those wires and batteries?! Lol
Well, there are hybrid and electric boats...
 

Sean L

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Ah...gotcha. Yeah, if that's the case, then 4WD could be possible.

Thanks for the education. Like I said, no familiarity with it. Not sure how our RAV4 AWD does it to be honest. Hate that fucking pile of shit.
On the subject of the RAV4 hybrid's AWD system, it has no driveshaft to the rear wheels. ICE and electric powers the front wheels and a smaller electric powers the rear wheels. Definately not meant for off road use but more for "Bad Weather" type of usage.
 

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Sean L

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Maybe I'm wrong and Jeep designs some amazing intra-transmission motor setup.
I've already put up a link to a Hybrid Transmission that ZF already makes. Something like that has the electric motors as part of the transmission and doesn't require a radical redesign of the entire drive-train like a full electric drive would.
 

Sean L

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A full electric drive would just bolt an electric motor to the existing transfer case with a reduction gear. They could probably fit a lot of battery between the frame rails and under the hood with no ICE/Exhaust system/gas tank.
Not the type that Rommel is talking about. One with a motor attached directly to each wheel. That type of drive-train would take a while to get into a practical size I think.
 

Toycrusher

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The resistance is just from people that are unaware or haven't tried today's EVs, or who are romantically attached to the past legacy of the Jeep. It's very similar to the long-running manual vs automatic discussion.

If I could build a magical wish list for a Jeep to hardcore off-road it would look like a fully electric Jeep. Instantaneous monster torque, no wheel slippage, no clutch delay, no downblast of air spewing dust everywhere. In an ideal EV, quad EV motors means no differentials, immediate and precise power to each wheel, better traction control, etc. Water fording concerns are eliminated completely (aside from floating your rig away) and it becomes infintiely easier to lift your Jeep without all of the complexities of an ICE engine. And you can save a boatload of weight by ditching all the underarmor for all of that equipment as well. All while getting closer to nature than ever before because your vehicle never makes more than a dull whine all day long.

A PHEV should be an incremental step to that dream rig.
I've built 4x4 electric rigs with quad motors. A differential with a locker is far superior. Under high load, like lifting wheels caddy-corner, it ends up functioning like a rig with open diffs, the wheels in the air spin like crazy and there isn't enough torque to get the wheels with traction moving, at least not in a slow controlled manner like you would want when wheeling. A single motor and traditional t-case and driveline is the preferred solution for slow speed crawling
 

rommel102

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I've already put up a link to a Hybrid Transmission that ZF already makes. Something like that has the electric motors as part of the transmission and doesn't require a radical redesign of the entire drive-train like a full electric drive would.
The Pacifica already used such a system. But it would be horribily inefficient at delivering power to the wheels.
 

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Toycrusher

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I think you guys are on to something here. I would like to see a full electric Wrangler with an on-board ICE to charge the batteries. Sort of like the diesel-electric locomotives. You could ditch the transmission completely, and possibly even the transfer case.
Problem is, you would need a full sized ICE, along with fuel system, exhaust system, cooling, etc just to provide the needed power to the EV motor. Then you would need your EV motor, controller, drivetrain, cooling, battery, etc to actually power the Jeep. In the end, you have 2x the cost for zero benefit as they gas engine is more efficient powering the wheels directly than it is generating, converting, storing, converting, and powering and electric motor.
 

Sean L

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The Pacifica already used such a system. But it would be horribily inefficient at delivering power to the wheels.
how would it be inefficient? The Pacifica Hybrid is dramatically more efficient than the non hybrid van.
 

Arterius2

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The resistance is just from people that are unaware or haven't tried today's EVs, or who are romantically attached to the past legacy of the Jeep. It's very similar to the long-running manual vs automatic discussion.

If I could build a magical wish list for a Jeep to hardcore off-road it would look like a fully electric Jeep. Instantaneous monster torque, no wheel slippage, no clutch delay, no downblast of air spewing dust everywhere. In an ideal EV, quad EV motors means no differentials, immediate and precise power to each wheel, better traction control, etc. Water fording concerns are eliminated completely (aside from floating your rig away) and it becomes infintiely easier to lift your Jeep without all of the complexities of an ICE engine. And you can save a boatload of weight by ditching all the underarmor for all of that equipment as well. All while getting closer to nature than ever before because your vehicle never makes more than a dull whine all day long.

A PHEV should be an incremental step to that dream rig.
While I agree with some of the points, there are a lot of optimism and wishful thinking there.
Going to EV, you won't shed any weight but actually quite the opposite. Batteries are extremely heavy, and if you just look at the some of the competitions out there you'd be dragging around 6000-10,000 lb all the time. PHEV will have the inclusion of both electric components as well as a "ICE generator".

Secondly, If you know anything about flooded Teslas, you would know that water and electric components don't mix.
 

Toycrusher

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I personally love the idea of a PHEV Wrangler, IF they can keep it reasonable. Weight is the enemy of performance, a 1000 lb battery would be counter-productive. But if we could get a 20 mile full EV street range, that would equal a 5 mile off-road range, which is enough for many trails, especially if the gas motor kicks in at, say, 20 mph.

I also DEMAND that this PHEV system be available with a manual transmission. It would replace the start/stop system, pull up to a light and the engine dies, no need to clutch. Pull away and at 20 mph the gas motor kicks in and takes over. Terrific for 4Lo crawling in silence without giving up full throttle dune running.
 

rommel102

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Not the type that Rommel is talking about. One with a motor attached directly to each wheel. That type of drive-train would take a while to get into a practical size I think.
For reference, here are the much more powerful Tesla motors in the D series. Anything under the JL would be the size of the Rear Drive unit or smaller most likely.

Model-X-dual-drive.jpg
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