Dealer Messed Up Order. Is limited anti-slip differential important?

[NavyVet1959]

My Ram had LSD and I noticed it obviously kicking in periodically if I was making a sharp turn at an intersection and the road was slick. As such, I ordered my JL with it.

LSD just lets you go places where normal 2WD would not get you and get stuck worse.
4WD just lets you go places where LSD would not get you and get stuck worse.
Winches just allow you to go places where 4WD would not get you, but you can still get stuck.
Cell phones might allow you to call a tracked vehicle to get you out after all else fails.

But even tracked vehicles can get stuck.

Once you start getting cocky, thinking you have a vehicle that can go anywhere, Nature will knock you down a notch and show you why in the end, it always wins.

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[NM Original]

Hi - Just got my build sheet for my JL Sport S and noticed the dealer forgot to add the LSD and all-terrain tires. Obviously the dealer can take care of the tires, but how big of a deal is NOT having the anti-slip? I'm tempted to have them start over, but my build is already two weeks in and about two weeks from completion, or so I'm told. Opinions?

1st, are you confusing a Build Sheet ( from FCA factory ) with a POC ( a Priced Order Confirmation ) which a dealer prints up?

If it is just the POC, that is your order in the Jeep System & pricing. If it is wrong, have them fix it. When the order is accepted, a Vehicle Order Number and a Vehicle Identification Number are (usually) assigned. They can either adjust it, or cancel it and enter a new ‘correct’ order. There is no cost for doing either of those. The VON and VIN will show up on your POC when issued.

The actual building of a Jeep is done in a day - usually about 900 or more a day. The factory issues the Build Sheet - their build recipe/inventory. When you see this, your Jeep is built.

My first Jeep order was for a Sport S. LSD was an excellent value and good way to beef up the Sport. To me it was a no brainer.

 

[Boatbuilder88]

is the anti-spin kit an LSD? the website didnt really explain it very well. i have the anti-spin kit. just not sure if i have lsd or not. i thought the lsd was an option on higher up models (i have basic Sport).

would worn out LSD be covered under warranty or is that just considered a wearable part?

Yes, the "Anti-Spin Differential Rear Axle" option is the beefier axle with the limited slip differential.

 

[Boatbuilder88]

I would mainly want the LSD option for the upgraded D44 M220 rear axle and the A/T tires.

The JL has Brake Limited Differential (BLD) which electronically simulates a limited slip diff by applying brake to the spinning wheel. Does it work as well as a a limited slip diff? I don’t have the answer to that. All the JL Rubicons are driving around with open diffs unless in 4 Low with the lockers activated.

The LSD is always active and works independently of BLD. BLD works with both axles but is only active in 4-Hi and 4-Lo. BLD will kick in if the torque bias is higher than Trac-Lok can handle.

 

[sigsegv]

The LSD is always active and works independently of BLD. BLD works with both axles but is only active in 4-Hi and 4-Lo. BLD will kick in if the torque bias is higher than Trac-Lok can handle.

Where'd you get confirmation that BLD is only active in 4WD modes?

My understanding is that BLD is Jeep's marketing term for traction control, which is still active in 2WD modes. If not, what's the difference between traction control and BLD? (stability control is a different thing entirely)

 

[RussJeep1]

My 2 cents: what do a Wrangler dealer and drug user have in common:

dropping LSD is bad

 

[wolfdog]

I think LSD's are great plus the better axle! However if you order LSD with "Selec-Trac" you lose the A/T tires, you get crappy Bridgestone H/T's (all season) tires!! Stinks but true, not that Bridgestone A/T's are perfect but sooo much better that H/T's!

Re order, and Good Luck!

Go Jeep!!!

 

[Capt-Zoom]

I wouldnt get it without the dana44 aka m220

 

[mtomac]

Yes, if you going off pavement or live where there’s snow

 

[JeepSmash]

I’d cancel and get the LSD.

 

[Jeepsterfreak]

Where'd you get confirmation that BLD is only active in 4WD modes?

My understanding is that BLD is Jeep's marketing term for traction control, which is still active in 2WD modes. If not, what's the difference between traction control and BLD? (stability control is a different thing entirely)

From the owner’s manual. It doesn’t mention anything about 4wd. It does say a “driven axle” so couldn’t that mean the rear axle in 2H?

Traction Control System (TCS)
This system monitors the amount of wheel spin of each of the driven wheels. If wheel spin is detected, the TCS may apply brake pressure to the spinning wheel(s) and/or
reduce engine power to provide enhanced acceleration and stability. A feature of the TCS, Brake Limited Differential (BLD), functions similar to a limited slip differential and controls the wheel spin across a driven axle. If one wheel on a driven axle is spinning faster than the other, the system will apply the brake of the spinning wheel. This will allow more engine torque to be applied to the wheel that is not spinning. BLD may remain enabled even if TCS and ESC are in a reduced mode.

 

[MacBigButt]

I'm an outlier, but I would never order any vehicle with limited slip based on my usage.

Ice and slippery conditions LSD is the suck. Yes, it could help with forward momentum but at the sacrifice of straight line stability. Same thing, off camber muddy trails limited slip will crab walk sideways off it.

For someone with a more rock climbing environment, sure it could help. Also, have a lot of gravel in my journey and LSD's last about 50k before the clutches are gone. BLD equipped vehicles work best for me (esp with full lockers in 4lo).

Yup, and with a manual it can be down right dangerous on icy highways. Let off the gas suddenly without depressing the clutch and insta-spin into the ditch. That might not be an issue anymore with modern stability control.

That said I always seem to end up getting LSD and on the Wrangler you get the axle upgrade.

So if you want it, get the dealer to fix the order.

 

[MacBigButt]

I think LSD's are great plus the better axle! However if you order LSD with "Selec-Trac" you lose the A/T tires, you get crappy Bridgestone H/T's (all season) tires!! Stinks but true, not that Bridgestone A/T's are perfect but sooo much better that H/T's!

Re order, and Good Luck!

Go Jeep!!!

Is that what happens? I've always wondered why I didn't get the A/T tires. I was going to swap them out anyways but I might have waited a bit longer if I had the A/T tires.

The H/T have to be the worst tire I have ever had on a vehicle.

 

[MacBigButt]

Good point, I forgot about that. With the BLD you may not need LSD, and BLD is standard. I haven't personally tested it, but a YouTube search suggests BLD does a helluva good job, in the least.



I've never heard of LSD resulting in diminished stability in snowy conditions. It keeps you stable in turns. Decent explanation here:

https://gizmodo.com/how-to-drive-on-snow-and-ice-1680981632

Highlights for the TL;DR crowd:

"Most cars have open differentials which just allow a slipping wheel to continue to spin. Better cars will use a limited slip differential, which will recruit whichever wheel on an axle that has more traction to help out."

For the record, that isn't what LSD does. A differential is a torque balancing device, so it makes sure each tire gets the same amount of torque. If one tire is on ice and spinning, there is very little torque possible on that wheel and the differential equalizes torque to the other tire so it has no ability to provide force, i.e. won't turn. All the engines energy goes into spinning the tire with no grip.

Traction control (BLD), applies some brake to the tire without traction, basically simulating traction on the ground creating an opportunity for torque, which it then balances on the tire that has real traction. So now the tire with traction gets power and can turn.

The friction in an LSD (either helical gear or clutch based) basically locks the two wheels together until the difference in force on the wheels when turning a corner overcomes the friction. So it's kinda the reverse of how brake based traction control works.

Check out this person's explanation...I'm to tired to do a good job of it tonight.

http://www.houseofthud.com/differentials.htm

Here is a great old school shop video of how a differential works...not relevant but totally cool



Also, for the record, BLD and LSD work great together and yes BLD works in 2-wheel drive if you don't have LSD.

 

[intentsrig]

As said by literally everyone else. Get the lsd. You’ll be glad you did the further you get into jeep ownership and modification.
One of my clubs requirmenrs is no D35. Lol I know it’s a different axle but Jeep failed at giving this new one the same name

Also, all new advantek 44’s (220mm) are 32 spline. Rubicon or not.

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