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Why Not A Rubicon?

S2k Chris

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I loaded up my Sport, and it had a $45k window sticker, got basically every option but the safety pack and the LSD I forgot to order (but it kinda sounds like I dodged a bullet there due to some problems?). A similarly equipped Rubi would have been $7-10k more, including some of the options not available I would’ve added (LEDs, etc).

I got my Jeep mainly because of the 4dr practical convertible factor, and it’s fun to drive, a great around town vehicle. I do some off-roading, but it’s not serious rock hopping. I live in IL, that stuff doesn’t really exist anywhere near here. Most of the off-road stuff I do is in support of hunting. We have 100+ acres of land we do a lot of work on, farming, building stands, and then obviously hunting itself, hauling out the harvests, etc. It’s rough enough that the guy we hunt with that has a new Ridgeline can’t get through many parts of the trails, but the guys with the TRD Tundra and F-150 have no problems except certain areas where the Jeep fits and their trucks don’t. But I have no problems with my Sport, and there are only a few places I’ve needed 4Lo, most of the time between 4Hi and the ABD system I get around just fine. A Rubi would be nice, but more for dick measuring and “nice to have”, not because I actually need the capability.

And as a guy with an expensive house and 2 small kids and all the associated costs, plus a sports car in the garage to support, the extra $7-10k for a Rubicon just doesn’t make sense.

Parked nearby ready to haul out a harvest opening weekend:
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Chocolate Thunder

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At the end of the day, I believe that with the exception of a very small handful of buyers, the decision to opt for anything other than a Rubicon boils down to money. Ask this question to yourself HONESTLY: if you’ve got $x to spend on purchasing a new Jeep (let’s for example say $35K) and you go to the dealership and the salesperson tells you that you can pick ANY Jeep on the lot or order one configured with any trim and any options that are offered by FCA, would you choose a Rubicon or something else? Yes, I know there’s a few luddites that actually DO want manual everything and no AC because of simplicity and they’re more manly than the rest of us. But excluding those <1% of Jeepers people would opt for more capability and options if they didn’t have to pay any more for it than a bare bones Sport.
 

S2k Chris

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At the end of the day, I believe that with the exception of a very small handful of buyers, the decision to opt for anything other than a Rubicon boils down to money. Ask this question to yourself HONESTLY: if you’ve got $x to spend on purchasing a new Jeep (let’s for example say $35K) and you go to the dealership and the salesperson tells you that you can pick ANY Jeep on the lot or order one configured with any trim and any options that are offered by FCA, would you choose a Rubicon or something else? Yes, I know there’s a few luddites that actually DO want manual everything and no AC because of simplicity and they’re more manly than the rest of us. But excluding those <1% of Jeepers people would opt for more capability and options if they didn’t have to pay any more for it than a bare bones Sport.
Sure it comes down to money, but it also comes down to whether or not you need the capability. Unless you are a serious rock hopper, you probably don’t.

Think of it this way, you’re going to the Porsche dealer to buy a new sports car. They show you a $50k Boxster. Then they show you a $60k Boxster that’s identical in every way, except instead of a top speed of 175mph, this one has a top speed of 200mph. Do you buy it, knowing it’s $10k more for something you’ll literally never use?

If you live on the Autobahn, or Rubicon trail or similar, the additional capability might be worth the $10k. For vast swaths of the country, it’s a lot of money for something you probably won’t use.
 

Chocolate Thunder

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Sure it comes down to money, but it also comes down to whether or not you need the capability. Unless you are a serious rock hopper, you probably don’t.

Think of it this way, you’re going to the Porsche dealer to buy a new sports car. They show you a $50k Boxster. Then they show you a $60k Boxster that’s identical in every way, except instead of a top speed of 175mph, this one has a top speed of 200mph. Do you buy it, knowing it’s $10k more for something you’ll literally never use?
You missed the point I made above. If they cost the same, yes I opt for the 200 mph car. Every time. The only reason I would even consider not buying the more capable vehicle is the $10K premium. Even if I never exceed 175 or even have the skills or access to a track to take it above 145 mph.

Also, 911 GT2RS.:)
 

S2k Chris

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You missed the point I made above. If they cost the same, yes I opt for the 200 mph car. Every time. The only reason I would even consider not buying the more capable vehicle is the $10K premium. Even if I never exceed 175 or even have the skills or access to a track to take it above 145 mph.
I didn’t miss your point, I agree it comes to money. But you missed my point, that at some point lighting money on fire to buy capability you aren’t going to use doesn’t make any sense. I can “afford” a Rubicon, if I really wanted to. I’m saying spending that $10k, knowing I will pretty much never flip those diff locker switches, makes no sense for me.
 

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Chocolate Thunder

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I didn’t miss your point, I agree it comes to money. But you missed my point, that at some point lighting money on fire to buy capability you aren’t going to use doesn’t make any sense. I can “afford” a Rubicon, if I really wanted to. I’m saying spending that $10k, knowing I will pretty much never flip those diff locker switches, makes no sense for me.
I get it. Fiscal responsibility is awesome, I wish more folks thought this way. But if you were financially irresponsible or independently wealthy, and you had those diff locker switches at your disposal, you just might choose different trails or lines or styles of wheeling that you know better than to try without them. Just a possibility, maybe you wouldn’t.
 

S2k Chris

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I get it. Fiscal responsibility is awesome, I wish more folks thought this way. But if you were financially irresponsible or independently wealthy, and you had those diff locker switches at your disposal, you just might choose different trails or lines or styles of wheeling that you know better than to try without them. Just a possibility, maybe you wouldn’t.
I live in IL. There’s really no place to go where I need the extra capability. I’d love to pretend I’d go to CO or UT or AZ or wherever every year and hit the hard trails, but there’s really not a scenario where that’s my reality. Maybe one day I’ll get that chance. But not with any regularity.
 

Chocolate Thunder

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I live in IL. There’s really no place to go where I need the extra capability. I’d love to pretend I’d go to CO or UT or AZ or wherever every year and hit the hard trails, but there’s really not a scenario where that’s my reality. Maybe one day I’ll get that chance. But not with any regularity.
I know what you mean. I live in flat southeast Texas. I’ve found myself driving hundreds of miles to go find cool stuff to drive over. COVID has kept me from traveling to Colorado and Utah and California to wheel it. So far. But I will. Hopefully soon. I didn’t imagine that I would or that I’d want to. But I do.
 

danm

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A friend who’s into racing told me once “It’s more fun to drive a slow car fast, than to drive a fast car slow.” I think the same is true for Jeeps.

It’s a lot more fun to drive a stock Jeep on a green/blue trail than a lifted Jeep with 37’s on the same trail.

So what happens? The guy with 37’s isn’t challenged by the green or blue trails, so he goes to blacks and reds. Now he’s having fun too.

My point is, a Sport is fun to drive. A Rubicon is fun. Lifted Jeeps are too. Doesn’t matter what you’ve got, there’s a trail out there that will challenge you.
 

Chocolate Thunder

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A friend who’s into racing told me once “It’s more fun to drive a slow car fast, than to drive a fast car slow.” I think the same is true for Jeeps.

It’s a lot more fun to drive a stock Jeep on a green/blue trail than a lifted Jeep with 37’s on the same trail.

So what happens? The guy with 37’s isn’t challenged by the green or blue trails, so he goes to blacks and reds. Now he’s having fun too.

My point is, a Sport is fun to drive. A Rubicon is fun. Lifted Jeeps are too. Doesn’t matter what you’ve got, there’s a trail out there that will challenge you.
I disagree with your friend and with the sentiment in general. I came from track cars. It is fun to drive a slow car fast. It takes more skill for sure. But nothing beats driving a fast car. Ask the driver of any back marker car in any discipline of auto racing.

I’ve driven a stock Jeep and it’s a blast. But I love the things I can do with a 2.5” lift and 37s even more. I can still do the green and blue trails and they’re still just as fun. But now maybe I can see what the black and red trails are about too.

Again, my contention isn’t that stock Jeeps or Jeeps with fewer features aren’t capable and aren’t fun. Of course they are. My contention is that if more money weren’t involved almost everyone would opt for a Rubicon if it cost the same as a Sport. That’s just what I truly believe.
 

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How about what you want vs what you need? Jeeps are very capable vehicles a lot more capable than the drivers who purchase them. Most of my purchases were wants. I have and do enjoy them on and off road. It’s great to be able to purchase what you want or make it what you want or need.
 

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As far as trim levels go....A higher trim level will almost always have a higher resale value than a lower trim trim level with after market options added to bring it up to the same level as the higher trim model.
 

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I can afford a Rubi and live in CO but still got a Sport. Buy what you want. I bet you'll have fun with either.
 

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I've run the rubicon trail in everything from my 89 xj on 35's and welded difs, to the wife's 01 wj on 31's with lsd's, to an 09 jk sport with a 3" spacer lift and 35's. We've yet to do it in the jlur on 37's, but having wheeled moab and big bear trails I can say hands down the jl will be the most fun. The older rigs had the added challenges of not having enough gearing, open difs, weaker parts (both the xj and wj have been left on the trail for a week at times to facilitate work and parts ordering), and reliability issues that the rubicon just doesn't have. You can get out and wheel in just about anything. The jlur can be daily driven on the hottest and coldest of days (ac and seat heaters), wheeled hard, and driven home at 85mph. No more trailer, no more tow rig, no more compromise. Yes it's an expensive rig, but it does everything we want it to, easily, without stress, and incredibly comfortably. Nobody needs a Rubicon, but if you can afford it it's worth every penny.
 

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I disagree with your friend and with the sentiment in general. I came from track cars. It is fun to drive a slow car fast. It takes more skill for sure. But nothing beats driving a fast car. Ask the driver of any back marker car in any discipline of auto racing.

I’ve driven a stock Jeep and it’s a blast. But I love the things I can do with a 2.5” lift and 37s even more. I can still do the green and blue trails and they’re still just as fun. But now maybe I can see what the black and red trails are about too.

Again, my contention isn’t that stock Jeeps or Jeeps with fewer features aren’t capable and aren’t fun. Of course they are. My contention is that if more money weren’t involved almost everyone would opt for a Rubicon if it cost the same as a Sport. That’s just what I truly believe.
Agreed. After over 3 years of being on this forum and into Jeeps, money and budget are the most common reasons why the Rubicon holds last place in overall sales numbers.

Also, it was a good back and forth between you and S2k. Great points made. One thing to add, is that hard trails aren't required to appreciate the Rubicon features. The axles will go a long way towards longevity, even for those who want larger than 35's on a jeep that'll never leave the pavement.
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